Men Flirt With my Coworkers, But Not With Me!

Estimated reading time: 17 minutes

Dear Dr. NerdLove:

I’m 20F, almost 21, a junior in college and I’ve been working my first job as a barista for about three months. Before I started this job, I didn’t think I was bad looking, not a 10 but at least a 6. But all my other young and youngish female coworkers get hit on and flirted with constantly by male customers, and I have literally not had this happen once. It’s not because I’m shy or unfriendly — A, I’m not, and B, shy pretty girls still get this. And it’s not that I can’t tell when a guy is flirting, because I see when it happens to them. The only other female employee under 50 who does not experience this is both overweight and unattractive, while I’m a good weight with a good figure, I just don’t have the best face or hair. Even the overweight girls with pretty faces get flirted with, not as much as thin pretty girls but not never, like me. It’s making me feel so ugly and depressed that I hate going to work, even though the environment is pleasant, the work itself is not too hard, and the pay and benefits are good.

The worst is when my coworkers complain about all the guys who want them and how much they hate it. They don’t seem like they feel scared or traumatized or anything, just competing to see who can humblebrag the hardest. I feel like a dirt-poor person listening to a bunch of rich people complain about how annoying it is to have more money than they know what to do with all day.

I have never dated or even had a guy seem interested in me, which before this I figured would happen eventually. But now I’m worried that I’m completely undesirable, or that guys care so much more about faces than bodies that I will need cosmetic surgery to ever attract anyone. For the sake of my mental health, I want to try to find a job that does not involve interaction with the general public. But those kinds of part-time office jobs are harder to find, typically more hours, less flexible around my class schedule and don’t pay as much. And I really need the money — especially if I’m going to be saving for surgery. What advice would you give me?

Beauty Pageant Drop Out

OK, I’m going to preface this by saying that I’m not inherently against cosmetic surgery. As a general rule, I think of bodies like cars or homes; if you want to make it truly fit you and make it uniquely yours, go for it. This is why I despise “these changes affect the resale value of your home”; if I buy a house, I’m buying it for me. I’m going to be the person there. I’m not buying it to hold onto it for the next person. So paint the walls, throw on some aftermarket mods, correct structural issues, do what you like to make it truly fit you. I would only suggest that you a) understand the risks that are inherent to all surgeries, b) make sure that you’re going to someone who can do the job properly and c) how things look at now may not be how they look later.

(A lot of procedures that get done don’t necessarily take the way that skin tone and elasticity change, the way fat redistributes, muscle changes etc. into account.)

But most importantly: you want to make sure that you’re doing them for the rightreasons. I don’t mean “it’s ok to get cosmetic surgery to straighten your teeth, correct for a birth defect, or traumatic injury but nothing else”, I mean “cosmetic surgery is often an attempt at an external solution for an internal problem”. A lot of incels, for example, have spent new luxury car levels of money on cosmetic surgery, only to discover that while their faces changed, their circumstances hadn’t; they were still the same people they were before they went to the doctor, and they still have the same problems. The problems were never about their brow-to-jaw ratio or their lack of “hunters’ eyes” or whatever, it was about how they feel about themselves.

All of that is a long-winded preface to my saying that in your case, BPDO, I don’t think cosmetic surgery is the answer, because I don’t think that’s the problem… in as much that there is a problem.

Now, I’m not there, so I can’t tell you what the difference is between you and your co-workers. Nor, for that matter, am I a mind-reader, so I can’t tell you what’s going on in these guys’ heads that’s determining who they flirt with and who they don’t. What I can tell you, though, is that it’s really easy to get locked into a narrative that makes sense to us, even if it’s not necessarily true. Each and every one of us is prone to confirmation bias – a cognitive bias that causes us to give greater credence and importance to things that align with what we already believe and to dismiss, ignore or simply not notice the things that contradict those beliefs. And this is true, even when those beliefs hurt us.

And part of the hell of it is that it’s a self-sustaining cycle. Our beliefs and attitudes shape the world as we see it and as we interact with it, for good or for ill. If we believe something to be true, we behave accordingly, and it becomes the filter through which we see the world. If we believe that, say, someone’s a bad person, we tend to see everything they do through that lens. Did they say “good morning” to us? They were snickering at us behind that smile. Did they just charge into a burning building and rescue two children and a basket of abandoned puppies? Probably did it to throw off suspicion and make people think they’re good.

The same is true with how we feel about ourselves. If we believe we’re ugly, then we’re going to find ample evidence that we are. Not because it’s actually there, but because it’s what we expect to see, and we’ll adjust our interpretations of it accordingly. Look in the mirror and we zoom in on all the things we think are flaws – any asymmetries in our facial features, any blemishes in our skin, folds and curves and lines that say “no, this person is not an Adonis or Venus carved from marble”. If someone acts one way to a co-worker and a different way to us, we’ll assume it’s because we’re ugly and our co-worker isn’t. Even if the person is perfectly kind and friendly or even flirty, there’s a natural tendency to either disbelieve it, discount it, assume that it’s a trick or a joke or that we’re just mistaken.

(And that’s before we take into account that people are bad at knowing when folks are flirting with them. Not men, not women, not non-binary folks, not pretty folks, not ugly folks, people. We’re great at telling when other people are flirting and being flirted with, but not when it’s directed at us.)

Here’s the thing tough: the fact that we feel that way is legitimate. Those feelings are real, we’re definitely feeling them. But the fact that the feelings we feel are real doesn’t mean that we’re correct about what’s going on or why. And that’s something that’s important to keep in mind, because, as I said, our brains are very prone to creating narratives that make sense to us but don’t necessarily reflect reality.

In your situation, there’re a lot of things that could be going on. One possibility is simply taste and aesthetics; what’s appealing to one person isn’t necessarily going to be appealing to everyone. Nobody – no celebrity, no influencer, no model, nobody – is going to appeal to 100% of the people, 100% of the time. What makes one person morph into a howling cartoon wolf can leave another person cold, and they’re both correct.

Some people love the All-American-Girl-Next-Door look. Others go hard for the alt-rocker or goth aesthetic. Still others like the “I have no pores, always perfectly contoured and shiny” Instagram beauty influencer look. That doesn’t mean that the other looks aren’t appealing or inherently ugly, it just means that some people prefer one look over another. People not hitting on you doesn’t mean that you’re ugly, it just means that you may not be their particular flavor, any more than you find every guy who comes through your door to be your favorite salty goodness. That doesn’t mean that all those dudes are like the love child of Quasimodo and the Toxic Avenger; it just means that they don’t rev your engine the way other folks do.

So, it could just be that where you work, more people are into one aesthetic over another. That’s not a flaw in you, that’s just circumstance.

Some of it could be behavior. Not that you aren’t being friendly or giving good customer service, but you may not be giving off a flirty vibe or inviting people to flirt. You may well be giving off a perfectly friendly vibe but still give the sense that you’re at work and you’re here to do your job, period. This can be especially true as time has gone on and you’ve been feeling like the odd woman out; the feeling of “nobody likes me” can bleed into your behavior and body language and discourage people from wanting to get flirty with you.

There’s also the fact that there are a lot of people who are just flirty. They’re not flirting with intent so much as flirting because that’s what they do. They flirt with folks, especially folks who will flirt back, because it’s fun and they enjoy it… but they don’t mean anything more than that. In fact, it’s even possible that the people who are most likely to be into you are the people who are the least likely to flirt – whether from shyness, from disbelief that their interest would be welcome or because they don’t want to flirt with someone who’s on the job because that’s often rude. Hell, they may even believe that you’re someone who gets hit on regularly and so they don’t want to be Yet Another Asshole hitting on you while you’re trying to just get through your day.

This, incidentally, is also part of why your co-workers are complaining. Something doesn’t need to be scary or traumatic to be inconvenient, annoying or upsetting. Someone who behaves as though you’re a thing to be consumed instead of a person may not be scary, but it sure as hell can get on your nerves, especially when it happens a lot. As I’m telling guys all the time: not all attention is wanted or welcome attention, even if you’re starving for it. Would you feel validated and attractive if, say, Grima Wormtongue were hitting on you? Or if someone you knew to be an unmitigated asshole wouldn’t stop trying to flirt with you every time he saw you? Or would you be annoyed by it?

Now, we’ve been talking about the why of it all, but let’s take a moment to talk about the what – specifically, what you should do about this? Ultimately, I think the best course is going to be what would be best for your overall well-being. You like this job, the pay and the benefits, but not how it makes you feel. That’s legitimate. The question then, is, would it be better in the short or medium term to adjust to the job and work on how you feel, or to find a job that – while not as ideal – doesn’t sandpaper your self-esteem?

I’m of two minds on this. On the one hand, I think it might – and I stress might– not be a bad idea to see if you can adjust how you feel – about yourself, about your job and about your co-workers – before looking for another gig. It may be worth your time to do some self-exploration about what you would want to be different and why. Are you more interested in being flirted with and being seen as similarly attractive as your co-workers for the validation? In hopes of finding someone to date? Would you feel better if you could change your expectations, or if you had different areas of your life that would provide the feeling that you’re not getting here? Perhaps having a stronger divide between who you are at work and who you are at other times might help, especially if you find your people elsewhere.

You mention that you feel like you have issues with your face and hair; are there things you could do differently with your style and presentation? Would working on finding a skin, makeup and hair routine help make a difference? If your workplace has some flexibility in its dress code, could you lean more into an aesthetic that feels true and authentic to who you are as a person?  

On the other hand, sometimes if you want to heal, you’ve gotta stop hurting first. Having a job where you don’t feel like you’re getting things rubbed in your face might free up the emotional bandwidth to work on how you feel about yourself, even if it’s not as lucrative or as convenient for a college student. It would mean sacrificing that flexibility and pay, but not feeling like you’re being punched in the soul every time you clock in for your shift is no small thing.

Alternately, have you looked into other jobs that might offer similar flexibility but are less front-of-house, or different hours and responsibilities? Working in a bakery – to pull a random example – might mean getting up at o-fuck-hundred and a lot of physical labor, but if you’re doing more baking and kitchen prep than sales, you might feel better about yourself and life in general. Plus: so many delicious, delicious carbs.

In my personal opinion, I think starting from a position on working how you feel about yourself would be the better decision. But that’s strictly my opinion; it’s yours that matters. You are the top expert in you, in how you feel and what would be best for you. If you feel like getting away from this environment be better for you, that’s absolutely what you should do. But it doesn’t need to be a binary decision, nor does it need to be a permanent one. You could, for example, sign up with a temp agency and do a string of short-term gigs, until you either decide you’re ready to go back to being a barista or you find a better option. You might even see if you can do both – cut back on your hours at the coffee shop while doing other gigs or even finding some side-hustle that works.

What I wouldn’t suggest is cosmetic surgery; not yet, and not until you’ve put a lot more thought and research into it. I don’t think it’ll give you the results you hope for or in the way that you hope, and I think that’d be a bigger drawback than anything else. Start with looking at internal and less intense or invasive options. Because if I’m being honest? I think this is far more about how you’re feeling about yourself than it is about some quality you lack or some defect in you. And if you can deal with that, I think you’ll find the rest will fall into place and you’ll be much happier and satisfied overall.

Good luck.

Hello Doctor, I could use some advice. There is a guy that I was introduced to me about four months ago and I know he has been in a bad headspace, mentally. His ex-girlfriend was emotionally abusive towards him, and he is currently in therapy working on those issues.

He has shown some interest in me romantically. He has told me about his attraction to me. We have hung out quite a few times, but he never initiates it. We have exchanged numbers, but he almost never texts me first I always have to text him and sometimes he doesn’t even reply or if he does it is days later.

When we do hang out, he spends time flirting with me. I am all for him, wanting to make sure he is in a healthy headspace before pursuing a relationship. I am just trying to make sure I am not wasting my time and whether I should be patient and wait for him to be ready, or if I should move on.

Waiting In The Wings

I think you’ve given yourself a false binary, WITW; I don’t think this is necessarily an either/or situation so much as a “yes, and” one.

Here’s the thing: your crush is dealing with some heavy shit. An abusive relationship, regardless of the type of abuse, can do a lot of damage, and it can really fuck with a person’s head. Just admitting that you were in an abusive relationship in the first place can be rough. This is one reason of why a lot of people stay with, or go back to their abuser, even when they theoretically know better. It can be especially hard for men, simply because of the beliefs and attitudes about men and masculinity. A man admitting that he was being abused by his partner, especially a female partner, is often held as a strike against him as a man. If she was violent, then he must be weak. If she was emotionally abusive, he’s even weaker because “because his girlfriend hurt his feelings”. And admitting that you’re someone who could be abused, who would end up in an abusive relationship is hard to swallow, regardless of your gender and sexuality.

And that’s before we get into the scars that these relationships can leave. If you’ll forgive an awkward and inelegant metaphor, someone who’s been in an abusive relationship can be a bit like an abused or mistreated pet: they may want love and care and to be loved, but they’re afraid to let people get close and may flinch, snap or run away. It can be hard for a victim of partner abuse to lower their guard, to let someone in or to feel like they deserve to be loved.

Now, it’s great that he’s in therapy. Getting out takes a lot of courage and willpower and getting help takes just as much. That says a lot about him and his character. But unfortunately, while therapy is going to be important, another important part of his healing is simply going to be time. There’s really no way to speed up that process, nor is there a way to ensure that, when the healing process is winding down and he’s both ready for a relationship and in good working order, that he’s going to want a relationship with you or the kind of relationship that you might want.

Right now, you’re getting mixed messages from him. I don’t think this is necessarily intentional and I don’t think you can really read things into this one way or another – not with the context you’ve got. I think its entirely feasible that he appreciates the interest and flirting, but isn’t necessarily in a good place to do more than that. He may have a hard time reaching out first or making the first move because of what happened to him and how his previous partner treated him. It’s also possible that, even absent the abuse, he’s the sort of person who’s just bad at initiating. It’s impossible for me to say.

If I were to guess? I think he appreciates having a person who he feels safe to be attracted to and to flirt with, but isn’t ready to do more than that or take things further. I think he’s still wrestling with a lot of demons and still dealing with the fact that he’s been through the fires of hell and he’s got the ashes to prove it. And to be perfectly honest: I don’t think it would be fair of either of you to be holding the prospect of a relationship over both of your heads. I think the feeling of expectations might be hard on him and I think the inability for him – or anyone – to tell you how long this will take and what the end results will look like is bad for you. On his side, there’s a distinct possibility that he might try to get back into dating before he’s ready; on yours, there’s every chance that you will be patient and wait and find out that this relationship simply wasn’t in the cards for either of you.

This is why I think this isn’t a binary be-patient-and-wait/give-up-and-move-on decision. I think the flirting and the connection is good, but I think it’d be better for both of you if you take the expectation of a relationship off the table for now. You two clearly vibe, but right now, things are unequal; the level of effort he’s putting in isn’t commensurate with yours, nor is what you’re getting back from him. If I’m honest, I don’t think he’s in a place where he can match it. So I think your waiting around for him is ultimately a bad idea. I think you’d be better off to stay in contact, but without the expectation that there’s going to be more. I think you should let yourself go out and meet other people, while he focuses on his healing. I think that’ll mean that you aren’t gambling on an uncertain future and he’s not going to be distracted or feel rushed.

If you two are right for each other and you have this powerful connection, you’ll still be right and still have that connection down the line, when he’s in a better place and able to reciprocate. If you’re still single or not seeing someone seriously, if he’s still interested and ready to date, you can return to the question and figure things out together. But until then? I think staying in contact is good… but let yourself be single and see other people.

Good luck